Playing with Google's Domain Age Factor
Posted Sunday, October 30th, 2005. Filed under CEO not SEO Stuff, Internet Marketing Mix, Internet Marketing Tips, SEO Questions.
As CEO of an SEO company who does sales too, I try to be realistic about what it takes for a website to get good rankings over time. One of my first questions to a prospective client is how old their website is, cross-referenced against the top 10 for their target phrases.
We mostly pass on leads for new sites because the games needed to get a new site into the top 10 aren't something I or most of our staff enjoy, unless the client is content to wait a few years. A typical conversation goes: client wants fast rankings for a brand new great resource site, and I have to explain the Google Sandbox, aged links, and natural link growth — and yes, that can mean waiting years.
When pushed for workarounds, I mention Google Adwords and Yahoo Overture as fast options, or more aggressive tactics on a secondary site that risk an overnight ban for being too aggressive, like buying an old site or slamming a new site with tons of links aimed at Yahoo and MSN instead of Google. I try not to recommend these things, but if Google's going to play with an age factor, sometimes I have to play along too. How do you guys play?
October 30th, 2005 at 9:05 pm
Hi Jim,
I like your honesty. The more clear you can set the expectations for a client, the better their experience will be.
These days I am much more comfortable with the phrase, “I don’t know.”
When I get the, “how long does it take,” question, I have a speech that I have come to memorize. “No one can guarantee when or even if the search engines will list your site for the phrases you are interested in. [If I'm feeling a bit snarky I say] No search engine optimization company knows any secret, inside information to get you special consideration to get you to the top of the engines. [And if I'm really on a role I say] And if they tell you they can guarantee a specific listing in a search engine’s organic results, they are lying to you. [Finally I say] This is what we do know, if you make a good web site, make a good plan and stick to it, you will prevail. Just stick with your plan.”
If they ask again, I simply say, “I just don’t know.” That typically resonates well with the type of client we are looking to attract.
The only reason I don’t personally go with the “years” commitment is because I’ve seen different things. Sometimes a site gets totally locked out. And sometimes they get in relatively quickly. There are many factors that I feel account for those differences. But I’ve been surprised by some quick listings every so often.
I always look forward to your blog posts. Keep up the good fight!
October 31st, 2005 at 5:42 am
I find that customers (perhaps unconsciously) ignore the part where I tell them Google listings could be a year or more away on a new site and that if they want Google traffic they should budget some Adwords money. Three months later they come back asking where their Google listings are. Rinse and repeat.
Every time I do new consult on a new site I am shouting the caveat about site age effect on Google listings louder and louder. The thing is the louder you shout it, the more the prospective customer is saying “he can’t get me into Google, he mustn’t be very good”. It really is a balancing act.
November 13th, 2005 at 9:40 am
Geez, i have this same conversation with clients and prospective clients every single week.. and im on the other side of the world.. Australia.
I agree with Adam, that you need to tell them about the ageing delay to protect your interests in 2 months after launch when they wonder why they are not listed.. (then you can say … well I told you so!!!) but at the same time, not give them all bad news.
People want to hear what they want to hear and if my competitor gives them a good warm feeling about their position, even with guarantees, it doesnt surprise me that we can get overlooked.
November 24th, 2005 at 9:41 pm
Hm.. Actually your blog is the only one I have started reading regularly. I also appretiate your honest way of writing - a consept many SEO’s seems to have forgotten.
I have a few clients in Norway, and luckily it is still fearly simple to get them ranked for local competitive words. But, even so I am still giving them the “it could take years” story. Luckily they know me from before and trust my advice.
I saw a fearly clear evidense that age of domain has an effect with one of the last sites I started working at. The doamin was registered before 1999, but they had never marketed the site. I get top 10’s for very competitive words even without any IBL tactics involved. It’s amazing how it works sometimes. When they asked me how I do it I answered honestly “I don’t know”. They did not believe me of course, and thought it was some kind of joke
August 2nd, 2007 at 8:51 am
Excellent post. I face same problems while talking to client’s. They always ask for top ten for very newly built sites.
September 13th, 2007 at 1:58 am
I find alot of web designers I know (who are not SEO’s) get annoyed when they are asked by their clients why their sites aren’t indexed by Google. It is very hard to explain to them that Google is not a web technology like html or css we have complete control over.
There is no doubt in my mind that site age is an important factor in receiving trust from Google and we try to emphasize this to our clients. I believe a good system is to start with an AdSense and SEO campaign and gradually phase out the AdSense campaign as the SEO begins to have a positive effect on SERP results. Also in terms of link building being harmful, it is possible to limit the damage by finding desired links in advance and phasing them in at a similar rate.
February 18th, 2008 at 8:51 am
jim - ur one of the few companies / sites to actually be so honest.
I often feel we who are honest are the minority. Like demonz tho, i agree the roll out of PPC is an alternative option.